Thanks lostmedia1975 I'm glad you enjoy the content!
Mess O' Blues has always been an interesting search for the fact that Van Partible is so heavily involved in its search. I'm not even sure if the issue is the fact that he doesn't want people to see it, it's the fact that he's the only one with a copy. I do still see a few people push the topic but since he's already made his opinion clear and there's nothing else anyone can do to find it, the search is closed.
Though that probably brings up a larger discussion when it comes to content that creators don't want released. I think someone asked me about this on stream once and I said, going after content that creators don't want seen depends on how strong of a connection they have to it.
For example if Mess O' Blues was released onto limited VHS that Van and a few of his friends had, yeah I would say don't go around and ask all his friends or try and source what happened to the remaining tapes since it would be such a small pool of people.
However, if Joe Murray said he didn't want the Camp Lazlo pilot to be released, doesn't have a copy himself, and is currently owned by Cartoon Network, I don't feel like it's as invasive to ask a large company like that or someone who was just hired to work on it from the studio for a copy.
Again though this is all in theory, if there was something offensive in the Camp Lazlo pilot or a negative factor for why it was lost, then I think that's something else that would have to be considered.
You don't think there's another copy of mess o blue out there in the wild though?
Thanks lostmedia1975 I'm glad you enjoy the content!
Mess O' Blues has always been an interesting search for the fact that Van Partible is so heavily involved in its search. I'm not even sure if the issue is the fact that he doesn't want people to see it, it's the fact that he's the only one with a copy. I do still see a few people push the topic but since he's already made his opinion clear and there's nothing else anyone can do to find it, the search is closed.
Though that probably brings up a larger discussion when it comes to content that creators don't want released. I think someone asked me about this on stream once and I said, going after content that creators don't want seen depends on how strong of a connection they have to it.
For example if Mess O' Blues was released onto limited VHS that Van and a few of his friends had, yeah I would say don't go around and ask all his friends or try and source what happened to the remaining tapes since it would be such a small pool of people.
However, if Joe Murray said he didn't want the Camp Lazlo pilot to be released, doesn't have a copy himself, and is currently owned by Cartoon Network, I don't feel like it's as invasive to ask a large company like that or someone who was just hired to work on it from the studio for a copy.
Again though this is all in theory, if there was something offensive in the Camp Lazlo pilot or a negative factor for why it was lost, then I think that's something else that would have to be considered.
You don't think there's another copy of mess o blue out there in the wild though?
The story I heard back when I was researching it, is that Cartoon Network only saw it and didn't end up with a copy. Van's mentor told him to show it to Hanna Barbera who was looking for original programming and from there it was reworked into the actual What A Cartoon pilot. There would have been no reason for them to keep a copy and I haven't really heard anything else that supports the idea there's more out there.
Even if Cartoon Network did though have one though, given the nature of Mess O' Blues being a student work made before his time at Cartoon Network, I wouldn't necessarily advocate for going through them to get a copy of it either.
The story I heard back when I was researching it, is that Cartoon Network only saw it and didn't end up with a copy. Van's mentor told him to show it to Hanna Barbera who was looking for original programming and from there it was reworked into the actual What A Cartoon pilot. There would have been no reason for them to keep a copy and I haven't really heard anything else that supports the idea there's more out there.
Even if Cartoon Network did though have one though, given the nature of Mess O' Blues being a student work made before his time at Cartoon Network, I wouldn't necessarily advocate for going through them to get a copy of it either.
It will probably only see the light of day if Van gives the blessing to release the tape after his death. Also I know this is unrelated, but I sent you more messages, so check them when you have the time. It’s more info on the subject.
Last Edit: Aug 19, 2023 0:24:12 GMT by lostmedia1975
The story I heard back when I was researching it, is that Cartoon Network only saw it and didn't end up with a copy. Van's mentor told him to show it to Hanna Barbera who was looking for original programming and from there it was reworked into the actual What A Cartoon pilot. There would have been no reason for them to keep a copy and I haven't really heard anything else that supports the idea there's more out there.
Even if Cartoon Network did though have one though, given the nature of Mess O' Blues being a student work made before his time at Cartoon Network, I wouldn't necessarily advocate for going through them to get a copy of it either.
It will probably only see the light of day if Van gives the blessing to release the tape after his death. Also I know this is unrelated, but I sent you more messages, so check them when you have the time. It’s more info on the subject.
It will probably only see the light of day if Van gives the blessing to release the tape after his death. Also I know this is unrelated, but I sent you more messages, so check them when you have the time. It’s more info on the subject.
Or if he has a change of heart.
You know, your comment literally just gave me a random idea. You know about the other piece of Johnny Bravo lost media known as JBVO? I had an idea where Elvis John from mess o’ blues shows up, and the canon Johnny bravo ends up having to fight him.
I picture this playing out like those family guy chicken fight rampage style, where they cause mass destructive environmental and economical disasters, like causing a NASA spaceship to crash into Lady Liberty or something.
I know this is unrelated, but I had to get it out. It was too interesting to let it go to waste.
The story I heard back when I was researching it, is that Cartoon Network only saw it and didn't end up with a copy. Van's mentor told him to show it to Hanna Barbera who was looking for original programming and from there it was reworked into the actual What A Cartoon pilot. There would have been no reason for them to keep a copy and I haven't really heard anything else that supports the idea there's more out there.
Even if Cartoon Network did though have one though, given the nature of Mess O' Blues being a student work made before his time at Cartoon Network, I wouldn't necessarily advocate for going through them to get a copy of it either.
Weren't clips without sound used as b-roll during Van's interview on one of the DVDs? If I'm not misremembering things, then that probably means whoever edited that interview had access to the pilot to use as b-roll.
Every day now all I see people talk about is pilots, commercials, bumpers, and sometimes even physical objects. These, while technically lost media, I feel like should really be on the back burner.
I don't know, I'm just tired and time and time again I find myself leaving only to just come back a week later. Why can't we search for things that really matter and the world would be better if we found? Why are people still searching for NSFL content when that was lost for a reason? Why is such a large amount of the community so infatuated with pilots and children's media when there is so much more things to be found out there?
Don't get me wrong, I totally understand your annoyance and struggle with the community, but I find it strange how you say this, then go on to say:
Also, to those people who think "nobody here cares about lost media" or "nobody cares about what I'm looking for," the world does not revolve around you. Everyone has their interests, and in this community those interests are pretty niche. Finding someone who has the same niche interest as you is hard, and you need to be patient and look for whatever it is yourself until someone else wants to help. You cannot interrupt conversations and ask time and time again to help find something and whine when people aren't interested. Nearly everything I have found, preserved, or helped in finding nobody has cared about. I am okay with that, and you should be too.
Not saying you should accept being ignored, far from it, but I don't get the message you're trying to send here. You're contradicting yourself.
I totally agree that at times it can be really irritating seeing all this research and archival effort being used for random Nick Jr./Playhouse Disney stuff, but like you say, there's people in this community who do share your interest(s), you just have to be patient and willing to look. I definitely agree that there could be some changes made to the wiki to make it a little more inclusive, like making articles a little easier to publish (pretty sure it's a submission system to fend off vandals/spam), but if you're wanting efforts to be directed somewhere more fitting, you have the power! I'm sure there's tons of people that would be more than willing to help you out.
I shouldn't be mad people are trying to look for lost promos too now correct? I guess it would be neat to have all the fox box 4kidstv one be found haha.
Post by forlornjackalope on Aug 21, 2023 16:57:45 GMT
Eh, I wouldn't blame you either way.
The problem with stuff like promos for me, or really lost media in general, is if it really is lost an unaccounted for or it's just super elusive but is in plain sight. This happened for me when I came across a Nickelodeon tumblr account that had two pieces of material from the initial Crybaby Lane premiere, being a promo and the credits with Melissa Joan Hart who was hosting the event. Was it ever lost? Eh, maybe. I'm not sure. It gets tricky like that sometimes.
The problem with stuff like promos for me, or really lost media in general, is if it really is lost an unaccounted for or it's just super elusive but is in plain sight. This happened for me when I came across a Nickelodeon tumblr account that had two pieces of material from the initial Crybaby Lane premiere, being a promo and the credits with Melissa Joan Hart who was hosting the event. Was it ever lost? Eh, maybe. I'm not sure. It gets tricky like that sometimes.
I saw that MJH promo for Crybaby Lane on Youtube over a decade ago so i'm pretty sure it was never lost.
The problem with stuff like promos for me, or really lost media in general, is if it really is lost an unaccounted for or it's just super elusive but is in plain sight. This happened for me when I came across a Nickelodeon tumblr account that had two pieces of material from the initial Crybaby Lane premiere, being a promo and the credits with Melissa Joan Hart who was hosting the event. Was it ever lost? Eh, maybe. I'm not sure. It gets tricky like that sometimes.
I saw that MJH promo for Crybaby Lane on Youtube over a decade ago so i'm pretty sure it was never lost.
Yeah, that's been my thought as well I suppose. It makes general fact checking a pain in the ass at times and I'm surprised with how Viacom is that it's still up.
Why do we put so much effort into searching for things that were never really "lost" to begin with, because we were never meant to see them? There's hundreds of video games, movies, and books out there that we have a fair chance in finding yet there is hardly any interest in them. I understand everyone has their specific interests and hunts, but I must ask, why do you search for some of these things? I see people come in and ask for sound clips from toys, extremely specific bumpers or dubs in a language they don't even speak. Ask yourself, are you actually interested in seeing this because you're interested in the content? Or are you just interested because it's lost and you feel compelled that, for whatever reason, it has to be found?
Also, to those people who think "nobody here cares about lost media" or "nobody cares about what I'm looking for," the world does not revolve around you. Everyone has their interests, and in this community those interests are pretty niche. Finding someone who has the same niche interest as you is hard, and you need to be patient and look for whatever it is yourself until someone else wants to help. You cannot interrupt conversations and ask time and time again to help find something and whine when people aren't interested. Nearly everything I have found, preserved, or helped in finding nobody has cared about. I am okay with that, and you should be too. In the end you should want to find something because you, yourself, want to see it, not because you feel it should be found just because its lost or for other people.
I don't know, I'm just tired and time and time again I find myself leaving only to just come back a week later. Why can't we search for things that really matter and the world would be better if we found? Why are people still searching for NSFL content when that was lost for a reason? Why is such a large amount of the community so infatuated with pilots and children's media when there is so much more things to be found out there?
I'm new here, and while there hasn't been anything lost I'm interested in finding, I think you make a point and answer it yourself in the same post.
With this being a hobby, you get all sorts of random people with their different things they'd like to find (personally, I'd say many of them look for "less important" children's media because many people want to revisit things they recall from their childhood, and that gives a strong motivation to find it if that thing ends up "lost" or otherwise unavailable. When I think of something I'd like to see, animation or art comes to mind. Probably not anything intriguing either).
Similarly to how you wonder why they don't search for other things, I'd say it's the same reason you aren't searching for theirs. This isn't a bad thing, having so many people interested in their own niche is how you get so many articles on this and many other neat searches you never would have seen otherwise. 99% of the stuff on this wiki or in this community I've never heard of before and still enjoy reading about them.
To get someone to want to find something, you would have to make them interested and I don't think that's easy to do at all. Both you and I probably don't care about finding an advertisement, but someone may have, maybe, a grandparent who remembers it from their past. And that's the start of their search.
Why do we put so much effort into searching for things that were never really "lost" to begin with, because we were never meant to see them? There's hundreds of video games, movies, and books out there that we have a fair chance in finding yet there is hardly any interest in them. I understand everyone has their specific interests and hunts, but I must ask, why do you search for some of these things? I see people come in and ask for sound clips from toys, extremely specific bumpers or dubs in a language they don't even speak. Ask yourself, are you actually interested in seeing this because you're interested in the content? Or are you just interested because it's lost and you feel compelled that, for whatever reason, it has to be found?
Also, to those people who think "nobody here cares about lost media" or "nobody cares about what I'm looking for," the world does not revolve around you. Everyone has their interests, and in this community those interests are pretty niche. Finding someone who has the same niche interest as you is hard, and you need to be patient and look for whatever it is yourself until someone else wants to help. You cannot interrupt conversations and ask time and time again to help find something and whine when people aren't interested. Nearly everything I have found, preserved, or helped in finding nobody has cared about. I am okay with that, and you should be too. In the end you should want to find something because you, yourself, want to see it, not because you feel it should be found just because its lost or for other people.
I don't know, I'm just tired and time and time again I find myself leaving only to just come back a week later. Why can't we search for things that really matter and the world would be better if we found? Why are people still searching for NSFL content when that was lost for a reason? Why is such a large amount of the community so infatuated with pilots and children's media when there is so much more things to be found out there?
I'm new here, and while there hasn't been anything lost I'm interested in finding, I think you make a point and answer it yourself in the same post.
With this being a hobby, you get all sorts of random people with their different things they'd like to find (personally, I'd say many of them look for "less important" children's media because many people want to revisit things they recall from their childhood, and that gives a strong motivation to find it if that thing ends up "lost" or otherwise unavailable. When I think of something I'd like to see, animation or art comes to mind. Probably not anything intriguing either).
Similarly to how you wonder why they don't search for other things, I'd say it's the same reason you aren't searching for theirs. This isn't a bad thing, having so many people interested in their own niche is how you get so many articles on this and many other neat searches you never would have seen otherwise. 99% of the stuff on this wiki or in this community I've never heard of before and still enjoy reading about them.
To get someone to want to find something, you would have to make them interested and I don't think that's easy to do at all. Both you and I probably don't care about finding an advertisement, but someone may have, maybe, a grandparent who remembers it from their past. And that's the start of their search.
I get why people look for things, my main point in the original post was just how imbalanced it is. Again, I have no problem with people looking for commercials or pilots or what have you, my problem is that dominating much of the community. Any search I see for something that isn't children's media or something considered creepy is very small and very private, and I think it hinders that. I just want a balance, that's all.
Well I think that's just how the demographic is at the moment. The people most likely to search for media that's more "mature", for lack of a better word, probably aren't common (at least here) for a number of reasons. Maybe not good with computers, less free time, or even just searching off the net. Many kinds of lost media like works of Shakespeare or artefacts won't take place online and are usually done by professionals and historians. At most the web is where the news of such findings ends up. As the lost media endeavor becomes known through popular culture, Youtubers and the like, there may be more older folks or kids learning and interested in finding older media. My point is, there isn't a fast easy way to "balance", you might just have to be the change you want to see.
Anyways, this site just happens to be one community that may not have a representative amount, type, or quality of searches. Maybe to find what you're wanting you could look for some new groups with those specific focuses? Reddit has a lostmedia community, and probably some for more traditional media.